[colorforth] jpeg decoder
- Subject: [colorforth] jpeg decoder
- From: Dirk Harms-Merbitz <dirk@xxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Thu, 30 May 2002 09:21:23 -0700
s/hiding/containing/g
On Thu, May 30, 2002 at 09:10:39AM -0700, John Drake wrote:
> From looking at Mark's code he didn't use a
> "C-implementation". The BMP format was probably
> first implemented in C. Does that make Chuck's
> implementation of it automatically "bloated
> and ugly"? And what, pray tell, are you going
> to use to communicate with Linux? TCP/IP?
> Haven't you then implemented one of those
> "committee standards" that you seem to despise
> so much? Using Linux as a remote procedure
> call server for ColorForth isn't "hiding"
> anything. And this "hiding" that you are
> trying to do is just what Chuck spoke against
> in the talk "dispelling the user illusions."
>
> Regards,
>
> John M. Drake
>
> --- Dirk Harms-Merbitz <dirk@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> >
> > Chasing C implementations of committee standards is
> > problematic
> > because it leads to unavoidable bloat and uglyness.
> >
> >
> > ColorForth exchanges source code so we cannot hide
> > the uglyness
> > in object code.
> >
> > But with a network connection we can hide the
> > uglyness in a Linux
> > box.
> >
> > On Thu, May 30, 2002 at 08:53:32AM -0700, John Drake
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > --- Jack Johnson <fragment@xxxxxxx> wrote:
> > > > Dirk Harms-Merbitz wrote:
> > > > > What will you do about Flash? QuickTime? Real?
> > > > >
> > > > > If people are willing to code for colorForth
> > then
> > > > please
> > > > > do not try to emulate Linux. We already have
> > > > Linux.
> > > >
> > > > I have to nitpick here.
> > >
> > > I hope you don't mind if I nitpick on top of your
> > > nitpick. :-)
> > >
> > >
> > > > There are a number of CF enthusiasts who would
> > like
> > > > to be able to read
> > > > various file formats for various reasons. Some
> > > > excellent examples of
> > > > needing JPEG encoders/decoders would be
> > interfacing
> > > > with digital
> > > > cameras, foundation for a Web browser,
> > > > interoperability with legacy
> > > > systems, etc.
> > > >
> > > > That's not to say that we all need them -- that
> > they
> > > > should be made part
> > > > of ColorForth proper-- but there can be value to
> > > > sharing code for things
> > > > that get repeated often.
> > >
> > > Taking this argument to its logical extreme does
> > > ANY graphics file format need to be part of
> > > "ColorForth proper", even one that's newly
> > > invented? You've listed some applications
> > > where a JPEG decoder would be nice. But there
> > > are many applications that don't require
> > > graphics at all. For example, any device
> > > designed for the blind. In that case speech
> > > synthesis would be vital. Speech regonition
> > > would be nice. Any graphics decoder of any
> > > kind would be dead weight. I think it's
> > > important to keep things modular enough to
> > > add in what you need when you need it.
> > >
> > > > Something else to consider is that though many
> > of
> > > > these legacy systems
> > > > come with a lot of baggage, they also come with
> > a
> > > > lot of history. Sure,
> > > > we could all roll-our-own audio compression
> > scheme,
> > > > but psychoacoustic
> > > > compression is extremely efficient and extremely
> > > > difficult to do from
> > > > scratch. The ability to read format X doesn't
> > turn
> > > > CF into Linux, it
> > > > just makes CF that much more useful when looking
> > for
> > > > a solution to a
> > > > problem.
> > >
> > > My thoughts exactly! It's one thing to come up
> > with
> > > your own graphics format because you have some
> > actual
> > > thoughts on how to do it better. It's another to
> > > come up with a graphics format just to be
> > different
> > > from Linux. (And Windows, and Mac, and iTV 4os,
> > > and Oberon, and QNX and every other operating
> > > system on the planet that supports JPEG.)
> > >
> > > > I mean, come on, you might as well make the
> > argument
> > > > that we shouldn't
> > > > have a mouse driver because that would make us
> > too
> > > > much like Windows.
> > > >
> > > > -Jack
> > >
> > > I suppose you can put the computer in the mouse
> > > like Jeff Fox. :-) (I'm still impressed by that
> > > demo.)
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > >
> > > John M. Drake
> > >
> > >
> > >
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>
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