Re: [colorforth] New Linux 4word

["Ray St. Marie" <ray.stmarie@xxxxxxxxx>]

Dear All, 

Ray here, and opinionated this time :)
First, the pleasantries.

On 4/18/05, Albert van der Horst <albert@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> But I can't run colorforth yet :-( . I got some advise
> from Tim Neitz. He happens to work on the other side of the canal
> in front of my house.]

I'm jealous, Albert, of your proximity to Tim. :)  If he can't get you
running, only Chuck can.
Tim, I'm jealous of your proximity to Albert. :)  If he can't keep you
heading in the right direction, then I don't know who can. Prob'ly
Mark ( I'm jealous of Mark too. ) :)

> I have now a disassembly with the mix of 16 and 32 bit code
> at the start sorted out. And a crawler that finds all code starting
> from the macro and forth vocabularies (is that the proper word).

Back to Albert.
How very cool is that? Well done, sir! 
What a great skill you enjoy, wish I was your student :)

I believe the proper word is "dictionary". There is a macro and a
forth dictionary.
I could be wrong about this.... and at the risk of being wrong about
other points, I continue.

To all:  
Pause........................breathe..........., here we go.
Imnsho :) , the environment is still small enough to keep an
understanding in one mind. Now, not being a "real" programmer, I don't
have any XP pair partner, or XP skills, or any programming phylosophy
that I adhere to religously...

Normally, I would agree with a "test suite", in just about any other
language, but...

We test every word as we create it. We have the glossary ( even
better, the block editor and now a fully functional viewer ( 2 infact
( ya Howerd, I'm jealous of you too...) ) )  to use, to find out if we
are stepping on the domain of another word or app. If a word works it
works and until we decide that it's interfering with another app,
well, that's when we change it. In fact, proper factoring of
applications in colorforth means making sure that words used in
several apps, get moved to blocks that load them globally, for
instance the 3 basic macro blocks 24, 26, and 28, if possible, or the
"Colors etc." block 30.  And just because Chuck coded those blocks,
that does not mean that they are written in stone, He's just another
programmer, folks, he just happens to see the problem domain from
unique perspectives.
( oops <startHateMail> ) 

Think of your end users, most of them are on this list. They need no
protections from your code, just the reason and the rationale. You can
bet that I hack your code to fit mine.

When you identify a word that gets used by more and more apps, you
move that word to the blocks that get loaded with block 18. ( or in
TIm's case, 60 ), if that is possible.
These early blocks ARE your global glossary, where as, words used
specifically for a particular application, only get loaded when they
are needed, when the app is loaded.

Think much more simply, and please please, don't bring programming
baggage from other languages. This is eternally new, its small and
it's so very simple that it's very hard to grasp, at first, and for a
while after you think you have it.
And while I agree that much smarter minds have taken the time to
identify proper programming techniques and "rules of engagment" over
the last hundred years...

We code the rebel!  How many of us are using this as production code (
save maybe Chuck etal, and Tim )?  It's an experiment with tremendous
potential.
But, "ju gutta be-ya playa" ( sic), to even get the thing running. We
know the rules and we know what your code does. We know you tested it,
because it works. And when I integrate it into my version, i'm
changing your code to meet the needs of my environment, so get over
it.

To me, the true point of colorforth is that it can be done. And that
has already been proven. Many have branched and experiment with the
ideas started here. Several are very good. See Enth with Flux,
Herkforth, or retroforth8, for examples that i've personally seen.
There are more.

Though I would like to see a full fledged OS here, sometimes I can't
stop but wonder, why? I have linux and windows for all that. What I
need is a playground for my ideas, and more interoperability, with
establishied OS's.

Men, professionally, I'm in the Materials Handling industry. Our
saying is "Shall we re-invent the wheel".

To Albert again, 
Good luck with the taxes!


> Groetjes Albert
> 
> --
> Albert van der Horst,Oranjestr 8,3511 RA UTRECHT,THE NETHERLANDS
> Economic growth -- like all pyramid schemes -- ultimately falters.
> albert@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx http://home.hccnet.nl/a.w.m.van.der.horst
> 
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> 


-- 
Ray St. Marie
Rastm2ATusersDOTsourceforgeDOTnet
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