Re: shitty programming [WAS: Chucks address]

["M. Simon" <msimon@xxxxxxx> (by way of Jaap van Ganswijk <ganswijk@xxxxxxxxx>)]

At 10:08 PM 6/14/00 +0200, Jaap van Ganswijk wrote:
>At 17:04 20000614 -0700, M. Simon wrote:
> >At 10:06 PM 6/13/00 -0400, vic plichota wrote:
> >> > >my 2 cents    - vic
> >> >
> >> > True. But sometimes that is good enough.
> >>
> >>
> >>Please don't take it personally, it was just a general observation --
> >>in fact I appreciate your point -- but I am in an absolutely terrible
> >>mood today (had to tell an abusive client to fuck off).
> >>
> >>
> >>cheers   - vic
> >
> >
> >No problem.
> >
> >In fact I agree.
> >
> >The sorry state of current hardware and software is because the two 
> disciplines
> >have become relatively isolated.
> >
> >The MISC group are the only ones trying to think about this subject in any
> >deep way.
> >
> >I read about a group trying to impliment C in hardware. What a hoot.
> >C internals are ugly and require LOTS of registers to make things even
> >quasi efficient.
>
>C is quite easy to compile for the conventional and RISC
>processors as long as they are orthogonal etc.
>
> >Then there is that ugly 'stack frame' . What an terrible use
> >of a stack.
>
>What is the alternative?

FORTH.

Preferably running on a MISC chip. But the MISC chip is not an absolute
requirement.

>Procedures/functions will need local
>memory so they will need some sort of stack mechanisme.
>It's also very inexpensive, just decrement the stack pointer
>and push the instruction pointer.

Sucks for passing data on the stack.

And of course the programmer is no longer  in charge. The compiler writer is.

I have spent many an hour when designing in C discussing what the compiler
might or might not be doing to our code.


>When you want you can
>also use a frame pointer but for C it's not strictly needed.
>All displacements on the stack (compared to the stack
>pointer) are always known.

At the compiler level. God forbid you might have to interface some
assy language to this kludge.  Can be done of course. Just bring
big buckets of $$$$$$.

I LOVE C.

Simon


>Groeten/Greetings,
>Jaap