home .. forth .. colorforth mail list archive ..

Re: [colorforth] Ideas

Mark Slicker wrote:


On Sun, 29 Feb 2004, Samuel A. Falvo II wrote:


On Sunday 29 February 2004 01:07 am, Adam Marquis wrote:

so do knowledgable ones. Sage one stay too quiet for me, I want them
to become wild and irresponsible, releasing impossible exploits

Sage people stay quiet for a reason.  There used to be a saying that went
something like, "The truely intelligent talk.  The truely wise listen."
I understand your frustrations completely.  But getting violent or
vociferous about it will only make you seem even more uneducated.
I don't place any value on education, I know what I want and there's people out there that want it too. 
We don't need educated people, we need capable people.


And that's the key.  You can't attack the problem until you're educated
in its domain.  In this case, you cannot hope to undermine the
established software development world until you *understand* it.
Learning C++ is **NOT** learning OOP.  You need to learn C++, Objective
C, Oberon-2 at least, Perl, Python, Visual BASIC, and straight C with
CORBA, COM (with and without all those APIs and the IDL to make it
happen), XML-RPC, etc.  Learn **WHY** these technologies were invented,
**WHY** they are so successful (which may not be the same reason).  And,
as you might guess, OOP is but one small nano-fragment of the whole
computer industry (really, it is).  There are so many other things to
learn about.

Once you become well versed in the modern state of affairs, THEN AND ONLY
THEN will you ever hope to sound half-way intelligent when talking about
the Forth programming language, its environment, its philosophy, and how
these may be applied on a *per-project* basis.
Learning takes time and energy. I dont want to waste those I dont want to preach, maybe only by example. If its per project basis, why learn so much stuff I won't use anyway? Although I admire Jeff Fox (c.l.f) and yourself (Samuel) for your quality verbose output, I don't aspire to attain the same level, as I don't master English enough and I'm not willing to master it enough, along with all those junk technologies (abstractions) just to act as the "perfect parrot". 


I would have to completely disagree with that. C++, et al are not a
requirement for Forth, althougth they could provide ample encouragement.
:)

I think Chuck had it right when he said to start simple. I've used this
principle to good success. When I'm overly ambitious, when I try to do too
much at once, this is when I typically fail.

That advice is the advice I pass onto to Adam. If you want to create your
OS, start with the simplest possible thing that could be considered an OS
and build up from there. Keep evolving the design and implementation. One
thing we forget is the that published colorForth did not magically appear
in its final form. It was a long evolution, which is in good part is
documented on Jeff Fox's site.

Mark
Thanks for the tip, I appreciate it from the one other than Chuck that wrote stuff using colorforth. 
I already have this in my mind, but hey, I wanted a shortcut ;p

Thank you everyone for listening,
Adam


---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: colorforth-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
For additional commands, e-mail: colorforth-help@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Main web page - http://www.colorforth.com